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Author   Topic : "Multiply and Screen"
blackcabbages
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 21, 2003 10:56 am     Reply with quote
Hi. I was just wondering if those here who work with Photoshop do not agree with using the 'Multiply' and 'Screen' modes with a brush to create shadows and highlights, the same way you disagree with using the dodge and burn tool.

Do you instead use different colors and tones to work on said shadows and highlights?
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bearsclover
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 21, 2003 3:56 pm     Reply with quote
Quote:

Do you instead use different colors and tones to work on said shadows and highlights?

Yeah, I pretty much do.

I use the paintbrush or airbrush tool in a similar way as I do in real life (with a pencil or paintbrush). I might apply some filters (like "blur" or "paint spatters") to my renderings, but that's mostly it. I also usually use a lot of layers.

But I am not pretending to be an expert in Photoshop. I'm "intermediate," maybe. I just sort of wing it and learn as I go along.
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Mikko K
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 21, 2003 4:19 pm     Reply with quote
Use whatever gets the job done.

I personally think that the more complex tools you use, the less focused you'll be on the actual image. So I don't use layers much.

The good thing about not using dodge/burn/multiply/screen etc. is that you have to really think about the colors and values when you're picking them manually. Of course, multiply/screen are close to using normal-mode brush with a low opacity to create transparency effects, so it would be stupid to say "don't use under any circumstances".
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bearsclover
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 21, 2003 4:24 pm     Reply with quote
Wow Mikko, I use a lot of layers these days. I have done complete pieces with no layers (before I knew about layers) and that was fine too, but layers are fun. I do have to keep track of them, though.

I do a lot of portraits, so I might have a layer for "deep shadows," or "highlights," and then I'll have a layer for "hair," and one for "eyes."

This is just the way I'm doing it now, and I like it pretty much. But there's still so much to learn, and so many different ways to do things in Photoshop! So who knows how my techniques will evolve in the future.
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cheney
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 21, 2003 8:10 pm     Reply with quote
Ansel Adams once said no image is truely finished without a bit of dodging and burning.
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Godwin
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 21, 2003 8:24 pm     Reply with quote
ive noticed quite alot of the good artists here do use different brush (or layer) modes, like dodge for intense light and stuff

my personal opinion is that, since it's avaliable, just use it, as long as it makes your image look better, just use it, unless you're trying to emulate (or whatever) the traditional media, just use it
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Wren
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 21, 2003 8:48 pm     Reply with quote
I use whatever tools i have at my disposal to create the specific effects i am after. Like bearsclover, i am learning photoshop as i go, and i figure the best way to discover what it can do is to try everything. So far i have had the best success with just using varying degrees of opacity and shades of color. But i still play with all the tools just to see what they do if nothing else.

I will say that for greyscale work, i like using the dodge/burn tool because i can use it the way i do my pencils and charcoals.
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Capt. Fred
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 22, 2003 4:35 am     Reply with quote
I used o be a layer junkie with a new layer for everything, but.. I think it's pointless. It's much nicer to work into one (or very few) layer(s) so that the image is built up as a completley homogeness interacting mass without clinical and perhaps arbirtrary seperation of the image. Tho if u want nice neat illustrations then sure the layer help things stay clean and tidy.
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liv the fish
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 22, 2003 7:07 am     Reply with quote
Personally, I like to pick the color I use for highlights and shadows. I tried Screen, Dodges, Burns, Multiples, etc. But to me they all felt too fake. I'm a big fan of varying colors in my paintings, have been ever since I wa kid. I wasn't able to put my own personal touch into them. I guess I felt I had less control over what the color was going to be and probably that I didn't quite have enough knowledge to predict where it was going to go.

I also like to use as few layers as possible. I just do that because I don't like breaking from the painting/drawing to select the different layer, and it's probably a left-over from traditional painting.

I think you should use whatever you're most comfortable with. A lot of those tools were put there to work on photographs, but we're artists. If we can come up with a reason to use something, why not. Just because myself or others shy away from something doesn't mean it's wrong. If you got a good reason to use a tool or get the results you want it's all good.

good luck,
Brian
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osku - - -
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 22, 2003 5:04 pm     Reply with quote
I use personally lots of layers, but not much burning/multiplying brushes. I use instead layers, that's been manually level editet or being assigned as multiply/screen, and then paint at the opacity channel. Ofcourse this depends on what kind of work i'm doing. I am doing most of BW drawings manually, because I don't have wacom (yet:) and use PS for foto-post processing. No, I'm not pro, so this is just IMO:)
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jfrancis
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 08, 2003 7:12 am     Reply with quote
Then there's overlay (or Hard Light, depending on which order you layer your layers), which is multiply and screen all at the same time. Colors above middle gray get get screened, while colors below middle gray get multiplied, so you can do both highlights and shading with one layer.

I think the choice of whether to use these or not depends on whether you like to work directly, like a painter, choosing the colors you intend to use yourself, or in layers, and closer to the math, more like a Renderman shader writer.

http://www.digitalartform.com/blendModes.htm

http://www.digitalartform.com/multiply.htm

http://www.digitalartform.com/screen.htm
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jfrancis
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 09, 2009 2:13 pm     Reply with quote
jfrancis wrote:
Then there's overlay (or Hard Light, depending on which order you layer your layers), which is multiply and screen all at the same time. Colors above middle gray get get screened, while colors below middle gray get multiplied, so you can do both highlights and shading with one layer.

I think the choice of whether to use these or not depends on whether you like to work directly, like a painter, choosing the colors you intend to use yourself, or in layers, and closer to the math, more like a Renderman shader writer.

http://www.digitalartform.com/blendModes.htm

http://www.digitalartform.com/multiply.htm

http://www.digitalartform.com/screen.htm


I came across this ancient post via a recent Google search for something and wanted to update what I wrote above.

Overlay is not a simple mix of multiply and screen...

http://www.digitalartform.com/archives/2009/04/some-thoughts-o.html
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